Liver Function

[Kati*did]

YooperMama -- thanks!  That all makes sense with what I've been researching.  Everything is so tied together!  I take depakote, which is a hepatotoxin -- so I think that has made my liver sluggish. This leads to the Syndrome X, which is basically what results in insulin resistance.  The extra insulin helps create the hormone imbalance and estrogen dominance.  The added insulin also brings on PCOS, which also adds to the hormone problem.  Oh...and exta insulin causes weight gain...which is also hard to lose if the liver isn't functioning well.  The fatty liver makes blood sugar control difficult (esp. w/diabetes), and so it is very hard to do a yeast cleanse.  And the remaining yeast wreaks havoc, as we all know.  Everything encourages everything else!  Where to start?

Okay, Yooper.  All this talk about symptoms, let's talk about healing the liver!    What are you supposed to do if you think you have liver problems?  I know you can do the liver flush until there's no more stones and then eat really healthy.  Anything else? 

abbilynn

Silymarin!!!!  This stuff is amazing for the liver -- cleaning and rebuilding it!
I take a small amount of it right now.  I would take more, but my meds are metabolized through the liver and I think it would flush them out.  Anyway, I don't want to find out.  I am really excited, though, because for the first time in my life I have a doc who wants to get me off my epilepsy meds -- doesn't think I still have it!!!!!!!!!!!!!  

I think that Liver Cleansing Diet sounds like something I could do without any problems to kidney or meds in liver.  Thanks for all the info!

[Kati*did]

Hmmm...... I wonder why you should avoid cod liver oil?  I thought that was supposed to be great for you.  abbilynn

Not sure, but maybe because an excess of vitamin A can cause liver damage and there's lots of vitamin A in cod liver oil.  So maybe if you already have damage, it's not good to risk the extra vitamin A?  Just a guess.   

[YoopreMama]

Hmmm...... I wonder why you should avoid cod liver oil?  abbilynn

I was wondering that, too...I hadn't seen that anywhere else.  
Katidid?
Likemanywaters?

[Kati*did]

Hmmm...... I wonder why you should avoid cod liver oil?  abbilynn

I was wondering that, too...I hadn't seen that anywhere else.  
Katidid?
Likemanywaters?

Right above you.   

[YoopreMama]

YooperMama -- thanks!  That all makes sense with what I've been researching.  Everything is so tied together!  I take depakote, which is a hepatotoxin -- so I think that has made my liver sluggish. This leads to the Syndrome X, which is basically what results in insulin resistance.  The extra insulin helps create the hormone imbalance and estrogen dominance.  The added insulin also brings on PCOS, which also adds to the hormone problem.  Oh...and exta insulin causes weight gain...which is also hard to lose if the liver isn't functioning well.  The fatty liver makes blood sugar control difficult (esp. w/diabetes), and so it is very hard to do a yeast cleanse.  And the remaining yeast wreaks havoc, as we all know.  Everything encourages everything else!  

Silymarin!!!!  This stuff is amazing for the liver -- cleaning and rebuilding it!
I take a small amount of it right now.  I would take more, but my meds are metabolized through the liver and I think it would flush them out.  Anyway, I don't want to find out.  I am really excited, though, because for the first time in my life I have a doc who wants to get me off my epilepsy meds -- doesn't think I still have it!!!!!!!!!!!!!  

I think that Liver Cleansing Diet sounds like something I could do without any problems to kidney or meds in liver.  Thanks for all the info!

Good guess on the cod liver oil...that sounds vaguely familiar.

Your experience sounds like it all points to the liver...how it all ties together is amazing.  Is silymarin the same name for milk thistle? If so, that keeps coming up, over and over again.  

I'm glad you have a doc working to get you OFF of meds.  That seems unusual these days.  I think the Liver Cleansing Diet sounds attainable, too...after the Master Cleanse, that seems like  a piece of um, healthy cake-alternative!?    I hope her book comes soon on interlibrary loan!

PS

You're too fast for me--you reply before I get the question out!   

[healthyinOhio]

Anything else? 

Before the days of WTM.......I had suffered from severe acne rosacea.  For those who aren't familiar with it, it isn't like teenage acne.  It reddens just your nose and your cheeks so it looks like you are perpetually sunburned. 
I did some research and believed that your skin was tied to your liver and decided to do some fasting and coffee enemas.  After a year of this(one fast and coffee enemas every three months), you couldn't see it, anymore.  I also drank dandelion and milk thistle tea on the fasts as well. 
So, this is my "liver healing" story.  Every once in awhile I start to see myself getting red in the face and I know it is time that I cleanse.  I truly am the type of person who needs to be drinking a liver aiding herb tea on a regular basis.  But........THEY TASTE SO GROSS!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

I couldn't do the liver flush because I am allergic to citrus fruits and the juice made my throat start to close. 

[abbilynn]

Anything else? 

I truly am the type of person who needs to be drinking a liver aiding herb tea on a regular basis.  But........THEY TASTE SO GROSS!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

I couldn't do the liver flush because I am allergic to citrus fruits and the juice made my throat start to close. 

Hey, I know what you mean!!  They are pretty gross.  I usually mix mine with some other herbal tea to hide the taste, then drink it really fast! LOL    I've tried hiding it in everything for the kids and they always notice!!  I've tried homemade hot chocolate, smoothies, kombucha, and juice. 

That's a bummer about the citrus!    Is there any other type of juice, like vegetable, that you could mix the olive oil with? 

abbilynn

[YoopreMama]

I truly am the type of person who needs to be drinking a liver aiding herb tea on a regular basis.  But........THEY TASTE SO GROSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!  

I couldn't do the liver flush because I am allergic to citrus fruits and the juice made my throat start to close.  

Thanks for sharing your liver success story, HinO!  

My PMS tea is good for liver...w/ maple syrup I really like it.  Is that a possibility?

I thought you could do the liver flush w/ apple juice or water?  

[healthyinOhio]

My PMS tea is good for liver...w/ maple syrup I really like it.  Is that a possibility?

I thought you could do the liver flush w/ apple juice or water?   

What is in your PMS tea?

REALLY?  Apple juice?  News to me!! 

[abbilynn]

Hey, if you can do it with apple juice, would it be safe for kids to do?  Not that they would have STONES, but just junk.  What exactly do you do for the apple juice way?

abbilynn

[YoopreMama]

See this link for the whole story...

http://curezone.com/cleanse/liver/huldas_recipe.asp

Here's the recipe:
Liver cleanse and gallbladder cleanse flush NO surgery

Ingredients

1/2 CupOlive Oil Extra Virgin  (= 1.25 dl)

1 Big grapefruit (2 small) (Or 3 lemons)

4 tablespoon EPSOM salts =  ( MgSO4 + 7H2O)

(EPSOM salts  = Magnesium Sulphate =  EPSOMITE = Magnesium Sulfate Heptahydrate)

3 cups water (=750 dl)

(P.S .!! 1 cup = 250 ml = 2.5 dl = 0.25 l )


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Comment inserted by webmaster:

 You can substitute 3 cups water (=750 dl) (that is used in this recipe to dissolve Epsom salt) with 3 cups freshly pressed grapefruit juice, or freshly pressed apple juice . That way you will not feel unpleasant taste of Magnesium Sulphate
( = Magnesium Sulfate = Epsom salt = MgSO4 + 7H2O) ]

[If using lemon juice, do not blend juice with oil.
Drink little oil, little juice, from 2 differnt cups.


If you mix oil and juice, it may (it doesn't happens always) sligtly congell, and get a slimy consitence that is not easy to swallow.
It may become slimy.

It never happens with grapefruit juice!]

[Kati*did]

Is silymarin the same name for milk thistle? If so, that keeps coming up, over and over again.  

Silymarin is actually the active ingredient in milk thistle.  I like to take just silymarin because I've read various places that Milk Thistle itself is not very water soluble, so it isn't very potent as a tea.  Not that it doesn't work!  HIO is proof of  that.    

Here's a couple quotes I found about Silymarin:

Milk thistle contains a group of active compounds called silymarin, an antioxidant that destroys cell-damaging free radicals in the liver. Silymarin, as well as its most active compound silibinin, can counteract damage to the liver caused by viruses, alcohol, acetaminophen (Tylenol) and other medications, environmental and bacterial toxins, and poisonous mushrooms.

Since milk thistle is poorly absorbed, drinking it in a tea doesn’t work very well. Look for concentrated formulas extracted from the seeds of the plant. These standardized capsules contain 70-80% silymarin or silibinin which is quickly absorbed into the blood where it goes to work.

How To Make Tea:

Milk Thistle is unique in that you can not make a medicinal cup of tea out of milk thistle seed and water alone. Silymarin, the active ingredient in Milk Thistle, is alcohol soluble. What this means is that Milk Thistle is not extracted in water effectively. In our research alcohol based extracts are the most effective means of ingesting Milk Thistle. This is why our company was born. It is not effective for anyone to buy milk thistle seed in bulk for the use of making traditional herbal tea. We wanted to create a solution. So, if you want to make milk thistle tea, your best bet is to find a high quality extract. From here, 1) Heat up a cup of water to near boiling. 3) Add the extract to the water and now you have an effective cup of milk thistle tea to enjoy.

http://www.skyeherbals.com/materia_medica/milk_thistle.php

Also, it mentioned this about the effects of milk thistle and the skin:

Inflammation:

Milk Thistle is also a Demulcent, meaning that it soothes and moistens the mucus membranes, kidney and bladder irritations and inflammations in general. Being a demulcent, it also greatly softens and moistens the skin. Patients with skin problems ranging from acne to severe eczema have reported a clearing of skin impurities, healing of redness and inflammation, a dramatic softening and moistening of dry, cracking skin, and a noticeable glow and radiance to the skin quality.

It suggested that the best thing to do in order to get the most good from milk thistle is to drink it as tea (for the benefits of the milk thistle itself) and to also take an extract or capsule of syilymarin to get the best bioavailability of that active ingredient to the liver.

[YoopreMama]

Thanks, Katidid!  That was most helpful.   

[healthybratt]

FYI:  Milk Thistle is also related to Ragweed, so if you have allergies to ragweed, you may also react to milk thistle.  I personally, am allergic to milk thistle.  Just a heads up.

[healthyinOhio]

FYI:  Milk Thistle is also related to Ragweed, so if you have allergies to ragweed, you may also react to milk thistle.  I personally, am allergic to milk thistle.  Just a heads up.

Really?  I have heard of the chamomile relation, but not milk thistle.  Nice to know, HB!! 

[crystal]

So, does anyone know if taking ground up milk thistle seed in a capsule has any effect?

[healthyinOhio]

3 cups freshly pressed grapefruit juice, or freshly pressed apple juice .

Does freshly pressed apple juice mean it is juiced?  Also, it says not to do the liver flush until you have done a parasite cleanse and a kidney cleanse. 

[daisey]

Anything else? 

 
I did some research and believed that your skin was tied to your liver and decided to do some fasting and coffee enemas.  After a year of this(one fast and coffee enemas every three months), you couldn't see it, anymore.  I also drank dandelion and milk thistle tea on the fasts as well. 
So, this is my "liver healing" story. 

I couldn't do the liver flush because I am allergic to citrus fruits and the juice made my throat start to close. 

healthyinOhio
can you be more specific about this fast.  I don't think my body could handle the master cleanse or a liver flush at this point.   I am looking for something that would cleanse a little slower and maybe over a longer period of time.
Thanks

[abbilynn]

Does the MC count as a kidney cleanse?  I took YA for awhile, so that should've taken care of parasites.  I want to do the liver flush on day 7 of the MC (I'm on day 4) but not if it'll make me sick! 

abbilynn

[healthyinOhio]

healthyinOhio
can you be more specific about this fast.

Of course.  This is always my way of fasting.  I couldn't handle the master cleanse, either.  I got terribly ill.  I am not sure if it was a yeast detox or perhaps hypoglycemia.  This is what I do:

I eat raw fruits and veggies for 3 days up to 7 days.  Then, I do a juice/broth/liquid diet for 2 days up to 7 days.  Then I go back on raw foods for a few days.  On my liquid days is when I do my enemas.  The longer your fast the more dramatic the results.  Let me know if you need help with anything else! 

[daisey]

thank you healthyinOhio
I will give this a try and let you know how it works for me.     I have the hypoglycemic issues too.   

[crystal]

So, does anyone know if taking ground up milk thistle seed in a capsule has any effect?

bump

[likemanywaters]

Hmmm...... I wonder why you should avoid cod liver oil?  abbilynn

I was wondering that, too...I hadn't seen that anywhere else.  
Katidid?
Likemanywaters?

I'm not sure if this is the right answer, but here's what I've read about Vitamin A.

Beta Carotene is converted to Vitamin A in the liver.

It wasn't vitamin A that induces liver toxicity per se but that 5000 IU to 10000IU per day could unmask a pre-existing liver condition.

Vitamin A as beta carotene, like in carrot juice & some multivitamins, your body can convert what it can use, & store what it can't in the skin.  In other words, you can't overdose on beta carotene. Now, the vitamin A in Cod Liver Oil isn't beta carotene...

[YoopreMama]

I have "The Green Pharmacy" by James Duke and another book from the library while I wait for my liver book.    I'll post some more stuff on what they talk about later...some new thoughts of different herbs...

I notice that my rash was itchiest about an hour after I ate. Weird.

It's improving for sure, and moles are drying up and falling off.   

I'm so glad naomismama told us about the eBay listing for DSS--20 # for $17 and free shipping!   

[likemanywaters]

So, does anyone know if taking ground up milk thistle seed in a capsule has any effect?

bump

I think it does, but the more I experiment around the more I find the mouth "preps" the rest of the body for what's coming. I'm a fan of herbal teas & tinctures for this reason.

[makingchanges]

After I posted on Mon. I went to Dallas (3 hrs. away) to my NP Dr. who is a cell microbiologist.Then I have been behind and I had a reaction to the Vitamin K he gave me. My heart has been racing and I have been panicy. The Dr. took me off it today and now I feel like typing.

My Dr. studied in Europe and mainly in Germany. He uses sophisticated testing machines that he got from Germany. So you will need to go to him for the testing. I am so sorry. Mon. I took a friend of mine with me and she had 19% liver functioning.

My lack of liver function was quite complicated. First of all, he found that I had a sulfur problem from taking sulfa drugs like Bacterium. I will try to explain. Sulfa drugs are designed to kill single cell creatures. We all know they are suppose to only kill bacteria, but they are not near that intelligent and they attack all single cells. The DNA picks up on the message, "No more sulfur". We have to have sulfur. In fact it is a very common element for us to use to make amino acids. If you have sulfur intolerance then you will not make methorne (I'm trying to Dr. handwriting ). You need mehorne to make tryptopha, tyrosine, cysteine, glutamine,glutamic acid, glycine ,histidine, and 2 other amino acids I can't read. Then I was not able to use  B6, B12, Folic Acid,  PABA, C, E, Essential Fatty Acids, Mg, Zn. Co, Cu, Mo, Mn, and I because of this sulfa message. He said I was starving to death. This helped to shut down the liver. My liver is also spinning to the left. One of the laws of physics says that everything must spin to the right. He gave me Cyto-Rodoxin to correct the left spin and a sulfur homeopathy remedy from Germany to correct the sulfur intolerance. I fill so helpless to not tell others how to get this sulfur homeopathic remedy. I was also given a liver builder. Beeyoutiful sells Silymarin Liver Support which is vary similar to mine. I have been taking it for 6 months.

I was also strong to sugar and resistant to insulin. I read others comments  on this prob. with the liver. Katy-did quotes "my liver sluggish. This leads to the Syndrome X, which is basically what results in insulin resistance.  The extra insulin helps create the hormone imbalance and estrogen dominance.  The added insulin also brings on PCOS, which also adds to the hormone problem.  Oh...and extra insulin causes weight gain...which is also hard to lose if the liver isn't functioning well.  The fatty liver makes blood sugar control difficult (esp. w/diabetes), and so it is very hard to do a yeast cleanse.  And the remaining yeast wreaks havoc, as we all know.  Everything encourages everything else!"

These were ALL my problems. I went to him because I had a yeast infection for 6 months. As I said the difluican just made my livers functioning nose dive. I got very tired, yeast infection, sickness, hormone imbalance, etc. I felt terrible. My doctor said I would never get better until I took care of the sulfur problem. I plan on asking him in 2 weeks how someone could buy the sulfur remedy.

He has been giving me liver support as well as zinc. He said that if you have a bad liver you have copper toxicity (read up on symptoms) and you combat copper toxicity with zinc. I started with liquid zinc and moved to tablets. Then we started on different cleanse such as chemicals, heavy metals, and food additives. These were homeopathic remedies to clean my liver. I grew up on the Gulf Coast which is loaded with chemical factories every sq. mile.

I hope this helps. I will be gone tomorrow, but will answer questions later.

[YoopreMama]

I think it does, but the more I experiment around the more I find the mouth "preps" the rest of the body for what's coming. I'm a fan of herbal teas & tinctures for this reason.

I am reading and finding the same...that capsules really aren't the most effective way to take an herb or supplement....the salivary glands really are useful in ways I don't even begin to understand.

My Dr. studied in Europe and mainly in Germany. He uses sophisticated testing machines that he got from Germany. So you will need to go to him for the testing. I am so sorry. Mon. I took a friend of mine with me and she had 19% liver functioning.

My lack of liver function was quite complicated. First of all, he found that I had a sulfur problem from taking sulfa drugs like Bacterium. I will try to explain. Sulfa drugs are designed to kill single cell creatures. We all know they are suppose to only kill bacteria, but they are not near that intelligent and they attack all single cells. The DNA picks up on the message, "No more sulfur". We have to have sulfur. In fact it is a very common element for us to use to make amino acids. If you have sulfur intolerance then you will not make methorne (I'm trying to Dr. handwriting ). You need mehorne to make tryptopha, tyrosine, cysteine, glutamine,glutamic acid, glycine ,histidine, and 2 other amino acids I can't read. Then I was not able to use  B6, B12, Folic Acid,  PABA, C, E, Essential Fatty Acids, Mg, Zn. Co, Cu, Mo, Mn, and I because of this sulfa message. He said I was starving to death. This helped to shut down the liver. My liver is also spinning to the left. One of the laws of physics says that everything must spin to the right. He gave me Cyto-Rodoxin to correct the left spin and a sulfur homeopathy remedy from Germany to correct the sulfur intolerance. I fill so helpless to not tell others how to get this sulfur homeopathic remedy. I was also given a liver builder. Beeyoutiful sells Silymarin Liver Support which is vary similar to mine. I have been taking it for 6 months.

I was also strong to sugar and resistant to insulin. I read others comments  on this prob. with the liver. Katy-did quotes "my liver sluggish. This leads to the Syndrome X, which is basically what results in insulin resistance.  The extra insulin helps create the hormone imbalance and estrogen dominance.  The added insulin also brings on PCOS, which also adds to the hormone problem.  Oh...and extra insulin causes weight gain...which is also hard to lose if the liver isn't functioning well.  The fatty liver makes blood sugar control difficult (esp. w/diabetes), and so it is very hard to do a yeast cleanse.  And the remaining yeast wreaks havoc, as we all know.  Everything encourages everything else!"

These were ALL my problems. I went to him because I had a yeast infection for 6 months. As I said the difluican just made my livers functioning nose dive. I got very tired, yeast infection, sickness, hormone imbalance, etc. I felt terrible. My doctor said I would never get better until I took care of the sulfur problem. I plan on asking him in 2 weeks how someone could buy the sulfur remedy.

He has been giving me liver support as well as zinc. He said that if you have a bad liver you have copper toxicity (read up on symptoms) and you combat copper toxicity with zinc. I started with liquid zinc and moved to tablets. Then we started on different cleanse such as chemicals, heavy metals, and food additives. These were homeopathic remedies to clean my liver. I grew up on the Gulf Coast which is loaded with chemical factories every sq. mile.

I hope this helps. I will be gone tomorrow, but will answer questions later.

Thank you for sharing your experience!  It adds more pieces to the this puzzle we're trying to figure out, for sure.  It sounds like you have a very good doctor. 

Homeopathic sulphur has been mentioned before, I think, by likemanywaters...I think it's easily available, no?

The copper thing is interesting, too, b/c I remember reading awhile ago about a zinc deficiency really being more something to do w/ copper.  We live in the "Copper Country" of Upper Michigan.  I think there's something going on there w/ me, too.

[Amey]

I've been reading this thread with great interest. I so much appreciate everyone contributing to this thread...YooperMama, likemanywaters, makingchanges, kati-did, etc. You guys are great. I am being *educated*.    Same with the oil pulling thread. Lot's of good info. Just wanted to say thanks!

[T]

Hmmm...... I wonder why you should avoid cod liver oil? 

I wondered if any of you had heard anything like this...an acquaintance told me that cod was a bottom dwelling fish and since the liver cleans out your system, you are taking the nastiest goo out of the fish (the cod's liver) and putting it in you.  This actually makes some sense to me but some 'bad' things are good things in other circumstances.  She told me to take salmon oil instead.  Any insight on that from any of you?

[Kati*did]

Hmmm...... I wonder why you should avoid cod liver oil? 

I wondered if any of you had heard anything like this...an acquaintance told me that cod was a bottom dwelling fish and since the liver cleans out your system, you are taking the nastiest goo out of the fish (the cod's liver) and putting it in you.  This actually makes some sense to me but some 'bad' things are good things in other circumstances.  She told me to take salmon oil instead.  Any insight on that from any of you?

I have heard this before and I don't think it's accurate.  Reputable manufacturers of cod liver oil have a thorough process of extracting that includes cleaning and testing for purity.  A lengthy outline of some of these processes are here:

http://www.westonaprice.org/modernfood/codliver-manufacture.html

I think that the main reason for the warning about cod liver oil for people with liver problems is because of the amount of vitamin A in it.   Vitamin A is stored in the liver, and if your liver isn't functioning well, this could result in a vitamin A toxicity (which could damage the liver further).  The great thing is that vitamin D protects your body from vitamin A toxicity, so Cod Liver Oil is a great way to make sure you're getting both at once, and avoiding toxictiy.     Just make sure you're getting the CLO from a reputable company -- or call to find out how theirs is processed -- because some companies add synthetic vitamin A to their CLO, and that can cause serious toxicity!   Here is a quote from the Mercola site:

Due to the commonly heard warnings that too much vitamin A is toxic and can result in birth defects, liver abnormalities, and reduced bone mineral density -- many people are afraid of taking too much of this nutrient.

What is rarely addressed, and must be considered along with these warnings, is the TYPE of vitamin A. There is a big difference between synthetic vitamin A and vitamin A from natural sources. Most cases of vitamin A toxicity result from an excess intake of synthetic vitamin A in supplements, NOT the natural form of retinol (vitamin A) found in cod liver oil.

Because cod liver oil contains vitamin D there's no need to worry about vitamin A toxicity if you take it in cod liver oil. It is virtually impossible to become toxic on vitamin A if you take it along with vitamin D. As evidenced in a study published in the December 2003 American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, vitamin D is associated with reduced vitamin A toxicity, and the vitamin D appears to protect against retinal toxicity.

http://www.mercola.com/forms/carlsons.htm

HTH!