Author Topic: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention  (Read 27605 times)

Offline *MommaJo*

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #30 on: June 05, 2008, 09:51:39 AM »
I've been reading the books recommended to me on this and another vaccination thread.  The Vaccine Book (Sears)  and Vaccinations: a thoughtful parents guide (Romm).  Very informative!  Thank you.

I was wondering what were the thoughts of some fellow welltellers on a comment in The Vaccine Book. 

Sears mentions in the Polio section that Polio was eradicated from the US more than 20 years ago.  He says that if we stop using this vaccine, polio may come back.  We don't give the vaccine to protect the individual child, but as a nation as a whole in the event of an outbreak.  He says that he tells his patients who choose to skip the Polio vaccine that their child is almost guaranteed not to catch Polio.  And that they better just pray that not too many of their neighbors make the same choice, or in ten years we may all be in trouble.

How do you all feel about that?  Protecting our Nation as a whole?  And, why do I feel like he's making me feel obligated to vaccinate my child to protect our Nation?   :-\



Offline mommie

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #31 on: June 05, 2008, 10:17:30 AM »
tHIS IS  a great thread...I recently read that the vaccine is contagious for 2 weeks after its given and I have several girlfriends who vaccine and I don't...wondering if I should stay away for 2 weeks or if that's old info...do you ladies let your babies hang together after recents vaccines when your children aren't vaccinated? Like 6 month olds who drool every where and share mouth toys even if you don't want them to :)

Offline Simply Kristen

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #32 on: June 05, 2008, 10:19:18 AM »

How do you all feel about that?  Protecting our Nation as a whole?  And, why do I feel like he's making me feel obligated to vaccinate my child to protect our Nation?   :-\

Yeah, he definitely has a standard MD approach to vaccinations. What I appreciated about his book was the description of vaccine ingredients/brands/how they are made. I wouldn't read this book first if you have a tendency to be swayed by fear of the standard Amercian Medical Association view.

If you keep reading, he actually does not suggest the Polio Vacc in his "alternative vaccine schedule".  ;)
Just keep reading Aviva Romm's book and focus on the Vaccine Making/Ingredients/Incidence Report of the Vaccine Book.  :)

Offline Roehrmomma

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #33 on: June 05, 2008, 10:19:21 AM »
For the most part that is not right anymore (from what "they" say) But I still keep distance.

Offline Simply Kristen

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #34 on: June 05, 2008, 10:21:41 AM »
tHIS IS  a great thread...I recently read that the vaccine is contagious for 2 weeks after its given and I have several girlfriends who vaccine and I don't...wondering if I should stay away for 2 weeks or if that's old info...do you ladies let your babies hang together after recents vaccines when your children aren't vaccinated? Like 6 month olds who drool every where and share mouth toys even if you don't want them to :)
this is discussed somewhere else.... which virus' in vaccines are Live and which are not. The Live Vaccines can be considered contagious... the Dead Vaccines... are not.

Offline herbalmom

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #35 on: June 05, 2008, 10:43:11 AM »
I know this thread is for the unvaccinated, but what about partially vaccinated.  Does anyone know if there are any dangers to starting a particular vaccine and not finishing it? 
My oldest was vaccinated through age 4, my second was through age 1 1/2, and the baby has had the birth and 2 month only.

With my 3 kids my oldest (he's 22 yrs old) had vaccines on a delayed schedule until he was about 6 yrs old. My DD had her 2 month shots (this was 16 yrs ago when the 2 month was the first) when she was about 9 months. She had a bad reaction (high pitched crying) & we haven't done any vax since. My youngest (he's 13 years old) hasn't had any shots at all. Not finishing doesn't seem to hurt my kids at all.

I do think the shots they DID get caused some health problems though & my oldest (the one that got the most vax) is the one with the most health problems. NOT that I'm saying the vax caused all of his health problems, I'm not saying that at all. I DO however believe that they have contributed to his health problems. Also I was fully vaxed & I believe it contributed to my health problems as well & my health problems when preggo contributed to all 3 children having leaky guts, allergies, etc of their own. Just my .02.

MANY people have only had part of the 'recommended' vax & it doesn't seem to hurt them. Since scare tactics is a big tactic used in getting parents to vax, if they had even a clue that NOT finishing a vax series would cause harm, they would use it as a scare tactic. To the best of my knowledge they don't use that one- just that a person won't be 'protected' if they don't finish the series. HTH. Blessings ~herbalmom

Offline TwinkleToes

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #36 on: January 23, 2009, 07:50:42 PM »
I'm not sure if I'm posting to the right thread....but has anyone read this article on CNN?  One child has died in Minnesota and four others are sick so far from Hib and they were not vaccinated.

 http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/01/23/hib.vaccine.cdc/index.html

Has anyone else read this or have any further information? 
« Last Edit: January 23, 2009, 07:52:17 PM by TwinkleToes »

Offline AllinHisTime

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #37 on: January 23, 2009, 08:16:17 PM »
I'm not sure if I'm posting to the right thread....but has anyone read this article on CNN?  One child has died in Minnesota and four others are sick so far from Hib and they were not vaccinated.

 http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/01/23/hib.vaccine.cdc/index.html

Has anyone else read this or have any further information? 

Personally, I think this is more fear mongering from the mainstream media.  More children die from drowning per year.  In this article they state it as a "preventable disease" but their implication is that is preventable only through vaccination.   

I feel sorry for the loss of the baby and the sick children, however, there are many factors that come into play as to why there were complications and death.  These include the immune health of the baby and other children.  Was the baby breastfed or formula fed? What was the diet of the mother, if she was nursing? Was the baby already immuno-compromised? Was the baby started on solids too soon, which could wreck havoc on the digestive tract and affect immune system?  Was the baby around a chld who was recently vaccinated with Hib vaccine?  There are more cases than reported of children who actually get the disease they are vaccinated for, go to daycare or school and spread it.  Vaccination does not equal immunity.  Vaccination does not always equal "protection".  If it truly worked as well as they think say it does, then why do the "protected" (those who got vaxed) get the illnesses?

They did the same thing in my state when one person was reported to have had the mumps. They never stated if they were vaccinated or not, but most often, these diseases are being spread by the vaccinated who end up with the illness as a result of the vaccine. 

Thanks for posting this!!  I like to keep updated on the latest news.
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Offline mykidsmom

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #38 on: January 23, 2009, 08:27:34 PM »
I'm not sure if I'm posting to the right thread....but has anyone read this article on CNN?  One child has died in Minnesota and four others are sick so far from Hib and they were not vaccinated.

 http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/01/23/hib.vaccine.cdc/index.html

Has anyone else read this or have any further information? 

I read this article and lots of thoughts popped into my head.  First, just because there is a vax for Hib does NOT mean that it has to be a deadly disease.   I tend to liken things like this to whooping cough.  Whooping cough does not have to be deadly.  A parent needs to use wisdom in deciding when it's time to take a child to the doctor.  I wonder, how long did this parent wait before deciding the child was sick enough that they might need medical care?  I think *most* parents actually error on the side of waiting too long thinking "it's nothing serious."  I think there is a point where parents need to use wisdom for when it's time to seek medical attention.  

The other thing that struck me was one child had already had one shot and another child had had all three shots but "had a compromised immune system."  Okay, is there is chance the vax itself had anything to do with their getting Hib?  So see, I see too many question marks to determine that this isn't anything other then a "scare" tactic to get parents to vaccinate.  I'm not saying a child's death is unimportant, but even their statistics from 1987 are not all that horrible.  4 tenths of 1% of children getting meningitis from Hib is not a national crisis nor is it a reason to vax every child on earth for considering the damage that vax's cause.  

I know with the MMR shot that it takes only one shot to actually be immune to it.  However, because 1 in 100 actually doesn't get immune with the first shot, rather then test everyone to see if they actually NEED the other two MMR's they just shoot everyone 3 times.  So is this the same with the Hib?  Does one shot create immunity and if it does then at least two of these children would have already been "immune"  - only they weren't - they still got it.  The others that got hib didn't die from it.  Just like whooping cough, I do not believe Hib is deadly when good caution and prudence are used by parents in treating them.  Look, sometimes you need an antibiotic.  This is one case where I would use an antibiotic for the disease over being vax'ed for it.  

I think that prudence is required when a young child gets influenza, and I think parents are responsible for having their children checked before it's too late.   I don't know the situation with these parents and perhaps it hit the child too fast but the reality is (I know this sounds harsh - I don't mean it to) it was one child.  Should we vax the whole country for it?  It's a tragedy for the family - not the whole country.  Okay, off my soap box.

My .02

patti
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Offline BigMamaH

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #39 on: January 24, 2009, 04:30:36 PM »
This thread is very interesting, I went ahead and started reading it from the beginning and had one overall thought to share.  Vaccinate or not, you are taking a risk.  When you vaccinate you risk side-effects associated with the ingredients they use in those shots.  If the risks weren't real, there wouldn't be a national fund devoted to compensating (as if one could ever be compensated for the life of their child) families whose child has a sever reaction or death due to a vaccine.  If you choose not to vaccinate, you risk your child contracting a disease she may have been immune to if you'd given her the shot.  Either way, you take a risk.  You (and your dh!) have to decide which risk you can live with.  There is no need for fear, just an educated decision.  Someone in this thread raised the question of if you vaccinate late do they still have to have all of the shots in a series.  We looked into vaccinating some of our children with DTP, they ranged in ages form 3-7, none had ever been vaccinated, and at our doctor's office, the older the child the less shots they need?!  Go figure!  Thanks for the book suggestions and insight, it is always fun to explore a topic with you ladies!
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Offline tynnille

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #40 on: January 24, 2009, 05:55:46 PM »
I agree with BigMamaH...I would also add that if you do not vaccinate you have to be willing to go beyond the 'norm' educating yourself on what and what not to eat to get healthy, what herbs to use when sick, etc. It is important to make educated decisions, otherwise you put yourself at greater risks. If you choose not to vaccinate and do nothing about making your body more resistant to sickness and are also not able to home treat against sickness, then it may have been better off to vaccinate (though I am not sure this is true). We must realize that many decisions are inter-related, and need to be weighed in such a manner.   

Offline AllinHisTime

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #41 on: January 25, 2009, 07:13:47 AM »
I can see where you are coming from.  Yes, there are risks involved with vaxing and not vaxing and one must be prepared to handle the situation when the risks become reality. 

My concern is in the freedom (or lack there of) in being allowed to act upon an educated decision.  No one threatens to call the authorities on those who choose to "go with the program" and vax.  'Tis not always so the other way around. 

When one chooses to vaccinate, unless they get their titers (blood work that actually checks for immunity to the disease) checked, you have no way of knowing whether you have true immunity to the disease you were vaccinated for. 

I came across this article recently by Dr. Tenpenny, and thought it was really good.
http://www.newswithviews.com/Tenpenny/sherri19.htm
A truth's initial commotion is directly proportional to how deeply the lie was believed...When a well packaged web of lies has been sold gradually to the masses over generations, the truth will seem utterly preposterous and its speaker a raving lunatic.-- Dresden James

Offline stebs7

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #42 on: January 25, 2009, 08:25:44 AM »
If you choose not to vaccinate, you risk your child contracting a disease she may have been immune to if you'd given her the shot.  Either way, you take a risk.  You (and your dh!) have to decide which risk you can live with. 

We vaccinated our first child until he was almost 2 years old (back in 1990).  Three others were vaccinated for tuberculosis only (they got me each time in the hospital after birth when I was too week to fight them - please lady, there is alot of tuberculosis in Poland.  Our only daughter, who was the only one born at home also - was not vaccinated at all.  We do eat healthy - though not legalistic about it either - today we even had Pepsi floats - for a treat. 

I am not afraid of them getting the diseases - more worried about what they will get from vaccinations.  Our children have had whooping cough, mumps, chicken pox.  I feel that because they have not been vaccinated (except the one for the younger kids), they are healthier because of that (and because each one was breastfed for minimum of 2 years - that to me is the biggest health builder).  My friend who is here has 4 children - was not able to breastfeed her last child because of having had her breast removed with breast cancer (the other one was modified without being asked - to match the work they did on the first - and therefore her ducts wouldn't work.  She has had no vaccinations and is over a year old.  She is amazed at how healthy she is - even without being breastfed - and credits the lack of vaccinating for that.  She does give her evening primrose oil to give her GLA that mother's milk has - and I gave her some glyconutrients months ago that she gives her (though she forgets to do it everyday).  I told her she should give her cod liver oil daily also.

Another friend has a 1 yr old son that they didn't vaccinate - she is amazed at how healthy he is - she says she knows the difference because she has 2 older children that they vaccinated - and they were sick alot.

I do agree that we must help build their immune systems - and believe that many children during the years of plagues and the childhood diseases that killed - were able to win over the diseases because of strong immune systems and things like the four thieves vinegar :)  I have heard from many old people here how natural it was when they were small for kids/but not only to have whooping cough and other diseases.  I can't imagine that all of those diseases are mistakes - but in someway serve a purpose to build up our immune systems - just my theory on that.

Its amazing also to me about the Amish - there is no Autism amongst them (they do not vaccinate) - unless they have a child from the outside (like an adopted child from outside their community).  Interesting.

Blessings, Nancy in POland

Offline prolifeguyswife

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #43 on: February 06, 2009, 08:02:41 PM »
I never saw an answer to the polio in the pool question?

We take our kids to the public pool, and they have a fabulous time. But I was reading in "How to Raise A Healthy Child in Spite of Your Doctor" that parents in the 1950's didn't send their kids to public pools because of the polio risk.

Now I'm wondering about the risk of them catching something because they're not vaccinated. Has anyone found more info on this?

Offline ladyhen

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #44 on: February 07, 2009, 06:18:42 AM »
I never saw an answer to the polio in the pool question?

We take our kids to the public pool, and they have a fabulous time. But I was reading in "How to Raise A Healthy Child in Spite of Your Doctor" that parents in the 1950's didn't send their kids to public pools because of the polio risk.

Now I'm wondering about the risk of them catching something because they're not vaccinated. Has anyone found more info on this?

I've heard that chlorine doesn't kill the AIDS virus. 

Back when we still took our children to public pool, we saw live head lice floating.   :P
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Offline prolifeguyswife

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #45 on: February 07, 2009, 06:37:26 AM »
I never saw an answer to the polio in the pool question?

We take our kids to the public pool, and they have a fabulous time. But I was reading in "How to Raise A Healthy Child in Spite of Your Doctor" that parents in the 1950's didn't send their kids to public pools because of the polio risk.

Now I'm wondering about the risk of them catching something because they're not vaccinated. Has anyone found more info on this?

I've heard that chlorine doesn't kill the AIDS virus. 

Back when we still took our children to public pool, we saw live head lice floating.   :P

I just read that you can't get the AIDS virus by bathing or swimming with someone who has AIDs.

As far as polio goes, I read that in 2000, the US stopped giving the "Shedding" (oral) vaccine, which was the live polio virus. Apparently now the injection-form vax is not "live" and can't pass to others.

Our public pool seems extremely clean...they check the little ones for swim diapers, and it looks really clean. It's in a richer neighborhood than ours, so I think they cater to a wealthier clientele.

I'm looking for more info, though, before we make a decision on this, so if anyone else has done research on it, I'd be interested to see if there's more info on spreading diseases to unvaccinated kids in the pool.

Offline shawnaincov

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #46 on: October 07, 2009, 04:24:51 AM »
I have a question too. I am returning to nursing(RN) and will of course be exposed to more. My oldest has had all of her shots, the second all but her 5 year and the same with the next but the. Any only has had his 2 Mon. Should I get them caught up because of my increased exposure?  I know it's strange to have a nurse asking these qestions. I have been taught that they are at a very great risk if not but I just don't know anymore. I want to do what is best for them. As we all do as parents. Thanks for any input.
Shawna

Offline prairiechild

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #47 on: October 07, 2009, 05:28:33 AM »
Shawna, I am also an RN, not employed at this time. I would definitely not vacc my kids because of returning to work. My main worry was always the resistant staph infections and of course, there is no vaccine for that. I would say the best thing would be to do some research on individual vaccines. Example... polio... eliminated in the western hemisphere, spread by person to person contact. No worries there... The Hep A, most kids don't have any symptoms, if they do it is diarrhea. Why vaccinate for diarrhea?

I would practice universal precautions with an emphasis on good hand hygenie, review individual vaccines and diseases and optimize health, vitamin D levels and nutrition.

Offline Mrs. B

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #48 on: October 07, 2009, 06:03:30 AM »
Shawna, I'm also an RN, and I have always worked in the hospital in some capaicity since my kids were born.
My kids vacs are not up to date and we haven't had them to a doctor in many years.  My kids are seldom sick, and I've never felt like I'm 'bringing things home' with me.  In fact many of the nurses I work with are currently out with different flus and viruses.  I've not even gotten them.  I think the good handwashing that is consistently practiced makes the biggest difference with this, along with having a healthy immune system.
The few times the kids get the sniffles are usually when they are in confined rooms with other children.
I would second what prairiechild said and look at individual vaccines, and see if there is really any possibility that you kids would pick up any of these.
My philosophy has always been that you're much more likely to be exposed to germs at your local walmart in the winter as people are nasty and coughing all over the place.  At least at work you frequently wash/use hand sanitizer and wipe down surfaces.

Offline shawnaincov

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #49 on: October 07, 2009, 08:37:26 AM »
Thank you both so much!! You make me feel much better!! I was really struggling because I don't want to give them anymore than what they've had. We're usually pretty healthy. Anything we get usually comes from church when the kids are cooped up with other snotty nosed kids for an hour or so during classes.
Thanks again
Shawna

Offline hi_itsgwen

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #50 on: October 07, 2009, 09:30:23 AM »
Shawna, you may also want to look at vit. D3 supplements as opposed to vaccinations.  Check the H1N1 flu thread for some studies that show that it increases immune response and keeps patients from getting otherwise widespread viruses.
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Offline Marisa

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Re: Unvaccinated: Risks, Worries & Alternative Disease Prevention
« Reply #51 on: October 09, 2009, 06:30:33 AM »
I've been worrying about this as well as my 8 month old and 4 year old aren't vaccinated and the oldest attends public school or even church nursery. Could you list what your daily protocol will be in immune defence for your kids? I'm trying to come up with one but there's so much info, it's confusing. So far, I thought vit.D drops, and raw garlic. But I'm not sure what else for the baby.