Author Topic: Nourishing the Endocrine System  (Read 64096 times)

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #30 on: April 19, 2008, 04:39:56 AM »
((((((((hugs to you Jennifer)))))))))  I am SO glad you've a sister to help you.

I will be honest and say that while I was nursing and losing the sleep it is my worst times. :-\ :-[  I kept on keeping on and ended up hitting bottom emotionally and physically after baby #8, but she was 6-9 mos old before that happened.  There were several years that I felt like I was swimming against mud most of the time, even with eating as healthy as I could. Several years of unexplained chronic back pain, too.   There have been times postpardum when I can't exercise and nurse at the same time, I'm too weak.  Pregnancy has been a struggle too, but when I lose sleep nursing it is the worst, and I do believe Dr. Wilson's book really spoke to me because, well, I experienced many of the things he writes about.

I am much better #10 pregnancy. I was much better after #9 birth because I didn't nurse, I got more sleep, and etc.  I did fall apart again due to a miscarriage 9 months after #9.   I am going through it right now because I want to nurse, but my husband and my "insides" know it is best for this family if I don't, at least not too long. :-\

Now, that sounds dark but it's not.  My testimony is God leads, He heals, He gives wisdom, and I feel as a result of how all this affected me, my husband and I are really more educated about how it needs to happen around here.

I have had to accept that I have to rebuild again, and again, and again.  I have to take symptoms seriously, and I can't ignore anymore.  Because, that's what I did before, that's what we did. 

There is a thread on adrenals that I'll link for you, and I will also say that Patti is most helpful in there.  She has been there done that where adrenals are concerned.  She is the one who recommended for me to take Isocort (adrenal horomone from sheep) for this pregnancy and I have done better in some ways, particularly emotionally.  I will continue to take Isocort while nursing and then come off of it after that because I don't tend to need it without the additional work of nursing or pregnancy.
I have listed what I do take in that thread, although I don't know, it may have changed slightly.  Dr. Wilson's book, as you know, has excellent supplement suggestions too.  I do some of what he says because, well, that's what my body needed.  I need to follow his diet, also, and I will get back to exercise slowly after this baby is born.  It will take time, as it may with you, too.  I have found that frustration due to wanting things to happen faster (anger even, and some sadness) will delay my healing.  Being thankful in the process (okay, so I'm glad I'm sharing this, because I wanna cry here at the work I already know it's gonna take) is a biggie for me, at least.  Thankful for healthful food, for good supplements, for family support, I have so much for which to be thankful.  It is a choice, by God's grace, that I can make to remember that and not despair, which will just put me in more pain and symptoms.

http://www.welltellme.com/discuss/index.php/topic,693.0.html

HTH,
Cara

Offline kper

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #31 on: August 19, 2008, 03:46:04 PM »
I was just sent this through a celiac's list I'm on.

"I have no adrenal function due to an autoimune disease and endrocrinologists will tell you there is no such thing as adrenal gland fatigue and if you honestly want to know the supplements at best are no better than sugar pills and at worst could kill you.  Adrenal gland malfunction can truthfully be fatal.  Don't be mislead.  It is an easy diagnosis, a blood test, and then you are tied to steroids the rest of your life."

Comments? What do y'all think?


" Elections belong to the people. It is their decision. If they decide to turn their back on the fire and burn their behinds, then they will just have to sit on their blisters." 

Abraham Lincoln

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #32 on: August 19, 2008, 04:31:23 PM »
It sounds like this person is very ill indeed.

I do not know about using steroids for adrenal fatigue.  If a person has adrenal failure, such as Addison's, then perhaps it is life threatening.  I would certainly think it would be very debilitating at the very least.

I do not agree about the statement of adrenal supplements being no better than sugar pills.  I've used Drenamin from Standard Process to boost my adrenals, Symplex F from Standard Process to feed my endocrine system, and Isocort (which is adrenal extract from sheep) to help my adrenals when I'm pregnant/nursing.  Those are definitely not, in my experience, sugar pill experiences.

However, if anyone thinks they can just pop a pill, any pill, and voila, the adrenals will come back up---the answer in my experience is No.  So, if any person has taken pills and done nothing else, then yes, I'd say it would seem like they are sugar pills.

I've had to eat a careful diet, rest carefully, say no to social situations, take specific supplements, etc, etc, etc, to nourish my endocrine system and the adrenals in particular.

I hope that perspective helps,
Cara


Offline mykidsmom

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #33 on: August 20, 2008, 02:14:33 AM »
I wanted to back up what Cara said.  I am on the verge of adrenal failure which indeed is life threatening.  I've been taking Isocort for a long time and can attest to it's worth.  There is a forum on the web for adrenal fatigue that I ran into in my search on Isocort and many of those people refused to take steroids and are taking Isocort in their place and were functioning well.  Isocort IS cortisol.  It's just a natural form of it. 

patti
For I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I've committed unto him against that day.

Offline crystal

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #34 on: August 20, 2008, 06:53:47 AM »
It sounds like this person is very ill indeed.

I do not know about using steroids for adrenal fatigue.  If a person has adrenal failure, such as Addison's, then perhaps it is life threatening.  I would certainly think it would be very debilitating at the very least.

I do not agree about the statement of adrenal supplements being no better than sugar pills.  I've used Drenamin from Standard Process to boost my adrenals, Symplex F from Standard Process to feed my endocrine system, and Isocort (which is adrenal extract from sheep) to help my adrenals when I'm pregnant/nursing.  Those are definitely not, in my experience, sugar pill experiences.

However, if anyone thinks they can just pop a pill, any pill, and voila, the adrenals will come back up---the answer in my experience is No.  So, if any person has taken pills and done nothing else, then yes, I'd say it would seem like they are sugar pills.

I've had to eat a careful diet, rest carefully, say no to social situations, take specific supplements, etc, etc, etc, to nourish my endocrine system and the adrenals in particular.

I hope that perspective helps,
Cara



Cara,

What is the difference between "boosting" and "feeding" the adrenals?  I am convinced that I have adrenal issues, but can't really justify spending too much on specialty supplements.  What is essential?  Where to start?

Crystal

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #35 on: August 20, 2008, 12:17:04 PM »
Hello Crystal,

I cannot answer your question from a medical perspective, only from a personal one. 

Feeding the endocrine system is making sure to take supplements that support the endocrine system particularly.  It also, to me, means eating things that help the endocrine system operate as best as is possible and having a lifestyle that does the same.

Boosting my adrenals, really, is feeding.  I unconsciously used boosting and feeding in what I wrote.  However, upon your question and thinking about it for a moment, perhaps I did mean that taking Isocort is in fact boosting--it is giving the body some of what the adrenal glands are indeed having a hard time producing at this time in my life.  Isocort is supplying actual horomone.  Drenamin is not.  It is feeding the adrenal glands in a supplement form so that the adrenal glands will produce their horomones in the proper way and in the proper amounts.

I personally would think that perhaps investing in the book Adrenal Fatigue, The 21st Century Stress Syndrome by James L. Wilson, ND, DC, PhD is a good first step.  There are many things in that book which can be done without many supplements.   

I hope that helps you, Crystal.  (((Hugs to you)))) 
I edited and removed the link to the adrenal thread.  Goodness, I realized you already read that Crystal.  So, I hope that book may give you some other ideas.

Cara
« Last Edit: August 20, 2008, 12:26:21 PM by cecac »

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #36 on: August 20, 2008, 12:22:11 PM »
I wanted to back up what Cara said.  I am on the verge of adrenal failure which indeed is life threatening.  I've been taking Isocort for a long time and can attest to it's worth.  There is a forum on the web for adrenal fatigue that I ran into in my search on Isocort and many of those people refused to take steroids and are taking Isocort in their place and were functioning well.  Isocort IS cortisol.  It's just a natural form of it. 

patti

I wanted to comment on this steroid situation.  Patti, perhaps you can help us understand a little about this.

In the Adrenal Fatigue book, Cushing's disease is defined as being, "a disease of excessively high lievels of circulating cortisol.  The most common cause of Cushing's disease is the use of prescription steroids........"  :o 

So, if a patient were to take steroids to help with Addison's, could that patient then struggle with Cushing's?

How is Addison's life threatening, Patti?  I don't recall reading that in the book.  And without the tests, is there any way to tell if you are crossing over into a dangerous zone?

Thank you!!
Cara

Offline just jane

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #37 on: August 20, 2008, 12:50:26 PM »
The question was not directed to me but I wanted to say that my aunt had Cushing's after being treated with major steroids for reuhmatoid arthritis.   I personally feel like a person with Addison's would only be leveling out their hormones to normal and it would not give them Cushing's.

Offline mykidsmom

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #38 on: August 20, 2008, 06:38:00 PM »

[/quote]

I wanted to comment on this steroid situation.  Patti, perhaps you can help us understand a little about this.

In the Adrenal Fatigue book, Cushing's disease is defined as being, "a disease of excessively high lievels of circulating cortisol.  The most common cause of Cushing's disease is the use of prescription steroids........"  :o 

So, if a patient were to take steroids to help with Addison's, could that patient then struggle with Cushing's?

How is Addison's life threatening, Patti?  I don't recall reading that in the book.  And without the tests, is there any way to tell if you are crossing over into a dangerous zone?

Thank you!!
Cara
[/quote]

Hi Cara,

Let's see.  Well, Cushings can be caused by overuse of medical steroids (as was stated the case with RA).  However, *most* Cushings cases are caused by an adenoma (tumor) on either an adrenal gland or in some cases the pituitary gland.  I was actually tested for Cushings when my adrenals first started crashing to try and figure out was wrong with me.

Addisons is a full on failure of the adrenal glands.  It is very life threatening.  When one gets sick, goes through any kind of stress (light or otherwise), walks, exercises, etc. the body puts out cortisol to help the person have the energy and physical strength to get through that period of time.  When someone has Addisons they produce no cortisol and therefore their bodies do not kick out the needed hormones for their bodies to fight.  Whether it be illness, emotional stress, etc. if you don't have cortisol to support your body the body just totally shuts down.  Also, cortisol is what regulates our circadian (sp?) rhythems.  If there is no cortisol, there is little to no ability to stay awake (major problem for me).   Anytime someone gets even a cold they have to increase their cortisol steroid hormones enough for their body to fight the cold. 

In the interest of full disclosure - I did just recently stop taking Isocort (it sounds above like I'm still taking it).  In talking to an "herbally" friend we talked about the adrenals potentially not coming back to life because I was feeding them artificial (although naturally derived) cortisol.  Kind of like the body thinks it's getting enough cortisol so it doesn't make the adrenals kick out any or even less and less the longer one is supplementing with cortisol.  So I stopped taking the Isocort and started (actually re-taking) rhodiola twice a day instead.   I have found I'm doing very well on the rhodiola and in fact, it does "feel" like I'm producing more of my own cortisol now. 

This is an issue I have not fully studied out.  But it does make sense that if you give your body a hormone it's supposed to be producing, that the feedback loop will tell your body you've already got enough hormone and not produce any for you.  But like I said, I haven't researched it out a lot. 

patti



For I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I've committed unto him against that day.

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #39 on: August 21, 2008, 04:38:41 AM »
Thank you Patti, I understand that explanation.

Thank you Jane, also.  So, I am thinking that Addison's wouldn't go over to Cushing's.

I'll just say that the endocrine system in it's entirety is a very delicate balance.

My husband suspects exactly what you are saying about long term use of Isocort.  Our plan is for me to get off the Isocort as soon as I wean my baby, and I will immediately pick up Drenamin.

I am going to also get tested, hopefully in the next six months.  I've been going on symptoms only (and done fine that way, as I'm not having life threatening or too debilitating of symptoms).  However, I am wondering if getting pregnant could actually push my adrenals over the edge.  My husband does not think so, as long as I continue to keep up working on the endocrine system through diet and lifestyle.

I am a bit discouraged right now.  The climb back up is so slow, and I have so little stamina, again.  But I must be thankful and keep going.  Sorry, today is just one of those days where I'd rather just feel better, Now.

Thanks for the info ladies!
Cara

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #40 on: August 21, 2008, 04:45:15 AM »
So, to keep this discussion on the endocrine system, if anyone is using any horomones, even naturally derived, I would think this dependency issue is something to be careful about.

In other words, if we don't Need to take horomones, even the natural ones, then let's not.   

The question still is:  How do we nourish the entire endocrine system so that the glands work together in harmony?

How can we accomplish this after that balance has been removed?

I am thinking it is a long road, not something that can be accomplished in the short term.  I also suspect that once balance is restored, it is a lifelong habit to keep it that way.

What Patti is sharing, this is key, IMO.  At some points of recovery we may have to use Isocort, Armour Thyroid, progesterone cream, etc.  But that does not automatically mean it is for the long term.  Although, I suspect that Armour Thyroid may be an exception.

Just some thoughts,
Cara

Offline mykidsmom

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #41 on: August 21, 2008, 05:36:18 PM »
I actually think Armour *isn't* any different then any other supplement.  I think anytime you supplement an endocrine gland with hormone that you risk that gland not functioning because the body sees the outside hormone and decides it doesn't need to make anymore.  That said, there are just times that one needs to supplement with bio-identical hormones.  I could have not survived the last several years without them.  Literally. 

I have nourished my endocrine system long enough that I can now start pulling back on the bio-idents and try to let my body pick up the slack.  One thing I noticed right off the bat is I felt worse for a week or so but I forced myself to work through it.  My body needed to remember what those glands were supposed to produce before they would start producing again.  KWIM?  Right now I'm taking Rhodiola and another supplement to nourish and feed my adrenals.  I'm eating mostly well.   :-\  I found sleep/rest and diet to be the #1 factors to my recovery.  There are times of high stress that I imagine I may have to supplement with Isocort for a day or two again to get through them but I believe complete healing will have taken place when I no longer have to do that.  I am also considering a tincture made by Mountain Herbs (?) that is supposed to nourish the adrenals.  I like Symplex F also as a gland supplement and will consider using it again if being off the Isocort becomes a problem again.  I want to try and avoid the hormone thing as much as possible because the longer you're on them the harder it is for the body to remember what it's supposed to do.  Thus far, I have not been able to go near going off of the bio-progesterone.  I tried a couple of times and it was a disaster so obviously I still have a long way to go when it comes to female hormone healing.

Cara, I'm with you on the exhaustion.  I hate having no energy.  I need to lose 40lbs so it's hard to tell what is weight related and what is gland related sometimes but then others it's obvious which is which.  I struggle so much to stay awake during the day.  Our lifestyle doesn't help either as we stay up late and sleep in late.  But that's what works for my husband's business so that's what I do.  I have been working on trying to NOT take a nap during the day at all and see if that helps with the adrenals but then I just crash after dinner for a half hour.   :-\ 

patti
For I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I've committed unto him against that day.

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #42 on: August 22, 2008, 05:18:37 AM »
That is interesting, Patti, what you say about Armour.  I guess I was supposing that once you lose thyroid function, it is more difficult to get the balance back.  Although, removal of the thyroid or part of it would likely require some Armour for your lifetime, correct?  Interesting enough, my MIL has functioned for years with only part of her thyroid.  She could not take synthetic thyroid due to symptoms, but she is on Armour now and it does help.  She is on Isocort also.

Another endocrine system issue is mineral depeletion and Vitamin B depletion.  I am thinking of iodine right at the moment.

As to the progesterone, I am wondering what the long term situation is with using it, as it pertains to menopause?  Perhaps it is on an individual by individual basis.

The thing that disturbs me about the good books concerning bio-available horomones and the endocrine system, is that I notice these natural doctors tend to be very open to bio-available horomones, and I don't read any caution as we are speaking about.  I've noticed this with Dr. Brownstein in his books on thyroid, and even Dr. Wilson in the adrenal book.  Although, Dr. Wilson doesn't push the bio-availables.  The other series of books of which I am thinking are the ones by Dr. Lee.  I have What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Menopause, and while I didn't read the whole of it yet, I did get the general impression of what I did read that he was pushing progesterone supplements alot.  That put up a caution with me.

Dr. Bruce West (www.healthalert.com) does not do this.  He has the same caution as far as bio-identical horomones, at least that is the general impression I have in what I have read of his newsletters.

When I wrote and asked him about my issues, Symplex F was what he recommended for overall endocrine system health.  He also plugs in Drenamin and/or Thytrophin for the adrenals and thyroid function.

Cara

Offline mykidsmom

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #43 on: August 22, 2008, 07:45:41 PM »
Hi Cara,

I think supplementing with thyroid depends on why a person is supplementing as to whether it will cause the gland to draw back its normal production.  If someone has lost part of their gland, obviously, there body isn't going to be able to produce enough (maybe) so would always need supplementation.  BUT, if we're talking about glands that are depleted and need nourishing vs. full on loss of function due to disease/illness, then I think supplementing should be done very carefully so as not to cause the gland to stop working altogether.  Does that make sense? 

Progesterone is something I'm still not sure about.  I only know I'm a mess without it.  Witchy is a good description.   :'( :-\ :P

I wanted to post here what I just PM'd someone because it really states how I feel overall regarding what to supplement with and when.  So here's what I wrote to someone:

"Yes.  I definately think Symplex F is worth being on.  Especially if your whole edocrine system is shot.  Along with diet, it might take awhile, but I think if you take it faithfully for a year or two that you will start to reap the benefits of a healthier endocrine system.  The hardest part is it takes so long when we treat ourselves naturally.  I would start with the Symplex for one month and see how you feel.  If you don't feel a LOT better, then I think it would be worthwhile to add Rhodiola (instead of Isocort).  Rhodiola nourishes the adrenal glands and provides energy (it is an adaptogen - which means it adapts to what your body needs are).  If you've been following the conversation on the endo system on WTM you know that my recent studies have yielded that treating with even natural hormones can cause your glands to not work in the long term.  So, I would try the Rhodiola (it's $10 a bottle at Freddies and lasts a month or more).  IF after a month of that and the symplex together you still aren't feeling well enough, then try the Isocort.  But I would do them in that order first.  You should look at the Isocort as a temporary solution.  Like a year or so. 

You are correct to say your entire endo system needs looking at.  What most people don't understand is that when one gland (ie. your thyroid) is deficient the body will take from the other glands to try and make up for it.  Then that one becomes deficient and the body takes from another gland and so on.  So you really need to nourish the entire endo system, not just one gland. "

I think that applies to sooooo many people here that I wanted to list it out.  Those are my preferences for supplementation.  I'm actually just getting ready to go back on the Symplex F after a long holiday from it. 


patti




For I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I've committed unto him against that day.

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #44 on: August 23, 2008, 06:15:26 AM »
Thank you for your thoughts Patti.

And I wanted to comment that it is Symplex F for females.  It is Symplex M for males. :)

I am on it right now along with the Isocort.  I am cutting back my Isocort as I am weaning my baby.

I know nothing of this Rhodiola, but I do have experience with Drenamin from Standard Process.  I have used it with success as has my OMD/chiro who diagnosed and helped me.

Would you happen to know, Patti, the ins and outs of using Rhodiola vs. Drenamin?  I will say that Drenamin looks to be more expensive. 

I would think one would take either of these products, not both.  My initial idea would be that if one is taking Symplex F, perhaps it might be better to stay with the other Standard Process product--might they work together?

I don't know (and not trying to be argumentative to you Patti).  These are just some wonderings.  Although, again, if the Rhodiola is an adaptogen, I would not know if Drenamin is. ???

Offline happy2Bhome

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #45 on: August 23, 2008, 01:28:23 PM »
Can someone tell me how much Symplex F and other Standard Process supplements you take a day (per meal)?  I took them for a while, but saw no real change.  BUT, maybe I was not taking enough.  It gets so expensive.   :(

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #46 on: August 23, 2008, 03:52:44 PM »
I only take them at breakfast and lunch.

When I was taking Drenamin, I took two twice per day.  That is what I take now, with the Symplex F, and I will also do the same with Drenamin shortly when I pick it back up.

HTH,
Cara

Offline mykidsmom

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #47 on: August 23, 2008, 06:57:54 PM »
I am so totally annoyed.  I just typed out a long post and my computer bugged out before it posted.  Grrrrrrrrrr.

Here I go again.....

I looked up Drenamin because I've never taken it before.  Drenamin and Isocort are both bovine adrenal extracts.  Therefore, taking both at once might not be a good idea as it could overload the body and make the adrenals "lazy." 

Here's a decent explanation of Rhodiola.  http://www.powersupplements.com/rhodiola/rhodiola.html  It is an herb that is frequently mixed with some ginseng and a few others herbs to not only boost the body but also nourish the adrenals. 

So, if it were me, I would take the Symplex F, Rhodiola and one or the other of either Isocort or Drenamin.  Like I said in my above post, I would only start out with one at a time if I were new to working on the adrenals to see what is helping and what isn't. 

patti
For I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I've committed unto him against that day.

Offline naturalgirl

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #48 on: August 24, 2008, 01:57:16 AM »
I am so totally annoyed.  I just typed out a long post and my computer bugged out before it posted.  Grrrrrrrrrr.

Here I go again.....


Lol. Been there, done that  :D I could've pulled out a few hairs myself when that happened to me.  :)

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #49 on: August 25, 2008, 05:01:46 AM »
Hmmm, Patti, I dunno about the information on Drenamin.  Can you tell me where you got the idea that it is live horomone?

Drenamin is not live horomone by my understanding per a pharmacist trained in the use of Standard Process products.  I specifically asked this when I became pregnant, as I wanted to know the difference.

I believe they did tell me, though, not to take Drenamin with Isocort.  But I am not sure I'd take the Rhodiola with Drenamin or Isocort either.  My line of thinking is that I wouldn't want to feed the adrenals to produce more cortisol while at the same time supplementing the cortisol from an outside source.  But I would, once I drop an outside source, want to feed the adrenals to maximize their balance. :-\

However, I don't have anything to back that up, just my thoughts.  Well, wait a minute, for me anyway, I guess I know why I am thinking this way.  It is because I've revved and crashed the adrenals before by taking B vitamins that my body was too weak to handle.  After having that experience twice, I decided to be cautious, very much so, on what I actually did take.  I've missed it a couple more times since then with B Vitamins (that's why for me it can get discouraging).     

I'm not sure Drenamin and Isocort are interchangeable.  Also, Standard Process does have a live horomone for adrenals.  Goodness, the name alludes me at the moment.  Anyway, I used Isocort because all in all it was less expensive.  I had to take more of the Standard Process one for it to work, and it was more expensive anyway.

That is why I am thinking the Rhodiola and Drenamin are the interchangeable ones--both are evidently for feeding the adrenals but not for supplementing with horomones.

I didn't know Isocort was bovine, I thought it was sheep. :-\

Well, Patti, thank you  for this discussion.  It is helping me learn, yet again.  Oh, and as to your post lost,  >:(  So, thank you for taking the time to re-post.  Everybody fusses at me to put my posts in Word and then.......but c'mon, we're adrenal weak here.  Do we really need extra steps? ;D

Offline happy2Bhome

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #50 on: August 25, 2008, 05:16:07 AM »
It is because I've revved and crashed the adrenals before by taking B vitamins that my body was too weak to handle.  After having that experience twice, I decided to be cautious, very much so, on what I actually did take.  I've missed it a couple more times since then with B Vitamins (that's why for me it can get discouraging). 

Can you explain what happened with the B vitamin situation?  I hope I'm not doing that! 

Also is Isocort by prescription only?  I'm just finding Standard Process to be so expensive.

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #51 on: August 25, 2008, 12:44:14 PM »
Hello Happy2bhome,

You can purchase Isocort off the Internet.  I usually pay $25 per bottle.  What are your symptoms for which you are using Standard Process supplements?

Hmmm, as to my Vit B experience.  I just felt revved up and sort of jumpy.  My chiro/OMD explained this to me.  I had begun to take Beeyoutiful's vitamins, which are a standard health food store variety vitamin.  Although, I believe there are some things in it (the SuperMom), like spirulina, that are not in other HFS varieties.  Also, the Vitamin B in Supermoms was not taking care of my deficiency symptoms which I cannot remember at the moment.  I just basically did not feel that using that vitamin improved my situation.  I also tried this with our HFS brand natural vitamins, and still was disappointed in the experience.  Drenamin just helped me feel more "even" stamina-wise.  Also, though, I generally take the Standard Process B vits, which can be a bit tricky.  I inadvertently took the wrong B's in my last pregnancy.  Cataplex G is the B supplement that helps with lowering high blood pressure.  I was taking Cataplex B, which is helpful in low blood pressure.  With adrenal stress there is the symptom of low blood pressure, which I've had.  However, in pregnancy, I deal with hypertension.  I think I may have actually made my Hypertension symptoms a little worse, and my chiro/OMD did say that I coould have done this.

So anyway, that's my B experience. 

You know, sometimes I think it is a good idea to go off all supplements and see how I'm doing.  I am thinking I may need to do this to see if my body is actually handling things on its own now.  Well, I may would keep up my Catalyn (Standard Process multi) and Cataplex G/B combo just for general purpose, but then wait on others to see how I'm doing.

And I guess staying fairly strict on a good/whole food diet is another thing I need to do while I test my condition. 

I am 3 mos postpartum right now.

 

Offline mykidsmom

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #52 on: August 28, 2008, 03:46:00 PM »
Hi Cara,

Just now getting around to this.  Sorry.  You're right.  Isocort is sheep.  Must have been a brain cramp.   ;D

The info on Drenamin comes from their website.  It says, "Three tablets supply 50 mg bovine adrenal and 40 mg bovine adrenal PMG™ extract."  The difference between Isocort and Drenamin is one uses bovine and one uses sheep.  Drenamin also adds some adrenal support herbs to theirs.  So, if it were me, I would not take both Isocort and Drenamin.  They are both using adrenal extracts of animals.  JMHO.

Rhodiola will not cause the adrenals to overproduce.  It will only nourish the glands and have them produce what the body needs.  It stops there.  That is why it's called an adaptogen.  It adapts to the bodies needs. 

patti
For I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I've committed unto him against that day.

Offline crystal

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #53 on: August 29, 2008, 06:12:35 AM »
Is the Symplex F similar to Drenamin and Isocort?

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #54 on: August 29, 2008, 10:45:10 AM »
Is the Symplex F similar to Drenamin and Isocort?

It is my understanding that Symplex F is for nourishing the entire endocrine system.  Drenamin and Isocort are specifically for adrenals.

Hold on, lemme get my Symplex F bottle:
Magnesium citrate, bovine ovary PMG extract, bovine adrenal PMG extract, bovine pituitary PMG extract, and bovine thyroid PMG extract (processed to remove its thyroxine).

So I definitely think that Symplex F is entire endocrine supplementation.
Hi Cara,

Just now getting around to this.  Sorry.  You're right.  Isocort is sheep.  Must have been a brain cramp.   ;D

The info on Drenamin comes from their website.  It says, "Three tablets supply 50 mg bovine adrenal and 40 mg bovine adrenal PMG™ extract."  The difference between Isocort and Drenamin is one uses bovine and one uses sheep.  Drenamin also adds some adrenal support herbs to theirs.  So, if it were me, I would not take both Isocort and Drenamin.  They are both using adrenal extracts of animals.  JMHO.

Rhodiola will not cause the adrenals to overproduce.  It will only nourish the glands and have them produce what the body needs.  It stops there.  That is why it's called an adaptogen.  It adapts to the bodies needs. 

patti


Oh yeah, Patti, brain cramp.  My kids are used to that. ::)  And seriously, I do think that's an endocrine issue.  I am having some health issues right now, and I cannot, sometimes, get words in my mind into words.  I also will be looking at something and say the word of what I'm looking at even though I meant to say something else.  And my short term memory (as in what were we talking about?) if I'm the wee bit interrupted is shot completely.  I'm not ususally like this.

I'm going to my OMD/chiro next Friday.  Boy are we gonna have a discussion on Drenamin.  I'll let ya know what he says, because I'm confused.  And also, if what you say is true, then oh my goodness I may understand why I'm having a few symptoms.

Live and definitely never finish learning over here,
Cara

Offline mykidsmom

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #55 on: August 29, 2008, 12:53:41 PM »
Crystal,

My ND in Oregon had me taking Symplex F with NO Isocort.  But she was a very medical person and I didn't like that.  There is adrenal extract in both so I would be careful doing both at once.  HOWEVER, (see how big that is?), if someone is badly adrenally low, I would rather take both those then both Drenamin and Isocort.  Those two are too closely related for my liking to to take both together.  My guess is that Symplex F has less amounts of adrenal extract because there are so many extracts in it.  Symplex F is definately useful for nourishing the whole system. 

hth

patti
For I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I've committed unto him against that day.

Offline MrsSWM

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #56 on: September 07, 2008, 10:56:26 AM »
Dear Cara,

Thank you very much for your reply! I'm so sorry I never responded. Our sweet baby arrived just two days after your post and I  had a long recovery afterward. Since then life had been zooming by at a rapid pace. I keep meaning to drop in and write here, but never seem to quite get to it! I had some quiet moments this afternoon though so wanted to say thank you for your kind and helpful replies.

It sounds like your little one has safely arrived as well :-)

God bless,
Jennifer

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #57 on: September 07, 2008, 04:16:21 PM »
Oh, you are welcome Jennifer.

I hope your endocrine system is healing up now.

I need to report back on my situation, and actually I need to post in the adrenal thread also.

My OMD/chiro told me my adrenals were blown, again. ::)  I'd been having foot pain since about the last trimester of my pregnancy.  He did some muscle strength testing and found that my adrenals are indeed weak and told me that foot pain is a symptom.  That was news to me.

He's been taking Drenamin for about 20 years, and he's studied Dr. Royal Lee's writings.  I asked him if Drenamin had live horomone in it.  He said no it did not.  He said that Drenamin has two components:  the majority of it is made to nourish the adrenals.  The other side of it, which is smaller in nature, has to do with communicating to the adrenals to actually kick in and work.  (He said, basically, it gives the adrenals a good kick in the pants). 

Interestingly enough, he told me Symplex F does the "kick in the pants" action for the pituitary, adrenal, thyroid.  It does no nourishment jobs.

He said you can get into a problem if you "kick in the pants" with the endocrine system but don't provide the nourishment.

He said that he is not using Drenamin anymore, and he recommended Quantam Adrenal Complex.  I am therefore trying it right now along with my other supplements (Symplex F being one of them).  He said it shouldn't be long before my feet quit hurting.

I got the general impression that he feels that Drenamin is a bit lacking in that you have to continue to take it.  He feels that I should take the Quantum Adrenal Complex for about a year, and it should actually nourish my adrenals to where I don't have to supplement all the time. 

Now I will be honest and say that my last appointment with this doctor was terrible.  I've never had a doctor appointment go as bad as this one.  I believe this doctor is under stress, but boy he went too far.  He was very straight with my husband and I about the possibility of my getting pregnant.  I know he cares about his patients, but the way he was with me was a bit of any outrage.  The only reason my husband didn't stop him was because it would have made the matter worse.  We got out of there as soon as possible, and I likely won't go back.

But anyway, he did help me for about six years.  And I'm praying for him. 

So I hope some of this information helps us, and I will let this thread know if the Quantum product is indeed helpful.

Cara

Offline crystal

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #58 on: September 11, 2008, 08:24:08 AM »
I hope you gals can help me.  I have been taking two Symplex F daily for the last two or so weeks.  I feel like I am going crazy!  The walls are caving in around me.  I have no ambition.  I am angry and irritable.  Everything and everyone is stressing me. 

Is it my body adjusting to the Symplex F?  Do I need to take more or stop taking it or wait for things to balance out?

HELP PLEASE!!!!   (For my family's sake! :-\)

cecac

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Re: Nourishing the Endocrine System
« Reply #59 on: September 11, 2008, 11:26:35 AM »
I hope you gals can help me.  I have been taking two Symplex F daily for the last two or so weeks.  I feel like I am going crazy!  The walls are caving in around me.  I have no ambition.  I am angry and irritable.  Everything and everyone is stressing me. 

Is it my body adjusting to the Symplex F?  Do I need to take more or stop taking it or wait for things to balance out?

HELP PLEASE!!!!   (For my family's sake! :-\)

(((((crystal))))  I bet ladyhen and patti could really help.  I'll give you some suggestions for some practical things (not supplements) that might alleviate these things for a time until your supplement situation is figured out.

I get these suggestions from my own experience of what has worked over the past 6 years when I get to where you are, angry and crashing:

1.  I have a talk with my husband.  In my experience it is imperative that he understand my condition.  Otherwise, as I'm trying to obey him, he ends up expecting things (or I end up feeling them expected) that are not helping me heal.  He is able, when he sees my condition, to tell me what he expects of me.  He is able to say, "No, we won't do this" at the appropriate times.  When in an adrenal crisis, my emotions go haywire.  I cannot say no.  But I can get guilty and angry.  Having my husband tell me what is good for me to do and what is not helps me concentrate (not something we can do in a crisis, very easily) on what is important to do.  And then, I can throw the guilt (and anger) out.  I also repent for the anger and determine to be thankful instead.

2.  Whatever I don't have to do, I don't.  For me, with 10 homeschooling children, right now in a crisis I can:  Teach my elementary children, one at a time during times that my littles are occupied.  I can train my children.  I can do the laundry with help.  I can oversee the food situation.  I generally cannot go anywhere, but maybe to church or social functions where I don't have to care for anyone but the baby.  If I am put in a position to care for anymore than the baby I will crash, usually the next day.  If I am pushed to go out too much, I will end up in a day of constant crying.  All of this time my pain levels will elevate, also.

3.  As to Symplex F, I take 4.  2 in the morning and 2 at lunch.  Symplex F does one job:  It is something that tells the adrenals, the thyroid, and the pituitary gland to do their job.  It does no nourishment jobs at all.  So, your body may be going haywire if you are taking the Symplex F without proper nourishment for the adrenals to actually do their job.  This information was given to me by my Chiro/OMD last week.

4.  What other supplements are you taking?  You may want to consider Isocort.  Do a search on the Internet and get it ASAP.   You can likely take the saltwater drink very easily.  That is explained on the adrenal thread here:  http://www.welltellme.com/discuss/index.php/topic,693.0.html

On the last 2 pages, we have been having some recent discussions.  Ladyhen does an excellent job at explaining this and other practical things you can do right now.

5.  How much sleep are you getting?  If you are not getting into deep sleep by 10:00 PM and being able to sleep uninterrupted for at least 7 hours, then that can be a huge contributing factor for your symptoms.  SC posted some information on sleep on the adrenal thread yesterday.  It is in yellow.  If you can get a mask, or make sure your room is totally dark in some other way, and make sure to get to bed on time, this will make a big difference, IMO.  Jane and I were just discussing using Tylenol PM or Benadryl to go ahead and get our bodies to go to sleep.  If you are waking up late, then I would suggest you do this until you get rid of the anger type symptoms. 

6.  Can you get ahold of MinTran (also by Standard Process)?  This is a good all around food source multi-mineral.  Sometimes lack of patience/anger can be magnesium deficiency.  I have noticed in myself a tendency to be mineral deficient.  MinTran is very helpful.  I take 3 in the morning and 3 at lunch.

You may be in some low level (or even higher level) depression.  I have a testimony about that:  I was taking Isocort in a pregnancy just recently.  I went off of it in a really bad flu experience (one symptom of depression is that I will lose desire to take care of myself.  I will not take my supplements.)  I made myself pick my Isocort back up (and likely increased it a little).  The next day my head felt much better and the depression was gone.

I am experiencing this again today after trying to drop Isocort last week.  I started back on Isocort, and the spiral of depression is beginning to lift already as well as some head cloudiness.  I could easily go into depression and anger with my children if I let this go too far. 

I am coming from the point of view, Crystal, that your adrenals are really suffering.  If they are not, then some of this may not be pertinent.  It's just that I've had your feelings, and my issues were adrenal, mainly, as well.  However, if you already know that this is not the case, then perhaps you need to take what I've said with a definite grain of salt.

I hope that helps.  I will pray for you tonight, Crystal.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2008, 11:39:09 AM by cecac »